McMonkey's Hellas PBEM

[McMonkey]

Multiplayer, so I need to know things like how well balanced it is, if the stats seem to work well and what I can add/alter. I may well convert it to ToT and alter the events to make a single player version later.

Thanks for the offer of help. I will upload the current files to the Scenario League tomorrow and post a link here so you know its there. Bear in mind there is still a little work left to do (sounds/some icons/text alterations etc...) but I am working my way through thew list now.

[McMonkey]

You can now dl the test files here: A Soaring Spirit test at Scenario League

Note that the game needs to be run using Civ2Unlimited. Also the two Persian Invasion events both trigger on turn one instead of around 500/490BC. I still need to finish off a lot of things but the core game seems to work fine. Feel free to make any alterations you want to the test files.

Read the Game Concepts section of the Civiliopedia for some important info!

Thanks for the help

[Alcibaides]

Cool, I will check that out tonight. I am not familiar with Civ2Unlimited, where cam i get that?

[McMonkey]

Its included in the scenario folder. Just copy the Civ2Unlimited .exe and .dll and paste them into your main Civ2 folder. It won't over write anything. To use it just double click the icon as you would with the normal Civ2.exe and you will see the launcher screen. Pick the relevant options (MGE/32,000 units) and hit the Launch button and Civ2 will begin as normal.

[Alcibaides]

I have played a couple of turns, it seems that the Ionians get overun by the Lydians in just three turns. I suppose they would have 250 turns to prepare for that invasion though. What is to stop the Greek powers from wiping out the entire Lydian civilization before those events occur? Thus stopping any Persian War before it starts.

I assume the map is fully revealed for testing purposes only right? I think it would be much more fun if the players had to explore.

I noticed there are no wonders yet, do you plan to add any? I think you should, it would make it more interesting. You could start with the real 7 wonders of the ancient world (aside from the Pyramids of course, which would already be built by this time).

I noticed that the resources do not appear to be spread out in the normal pattern, i.e. so that a max of 4 resources can be exploited per city. There are some spots where one city could have 5 resources. Is that on purpose to encourage colonization in certain spots?

That's all for now, I will continue to play around with it....

[McMonkey]

Re: Lydians/Persians
I have created a unit called 'Eastern Fortress' to protect the core Lydian cities. This unit is virtually invisible so the Lydians should survive until the Persian Invasions. I guess in an alternative history situation it might have been possible for the Greek city states to unite and attack Lydia/Persia before Alexander's time but for the purposes of this scenario it is not an option.

The Ionian's will certainly be better prepared for the Persian invasions and should hold out for longer. They are the largest playable Civ at the start of the game but the trade-off is that they'll be the first in line to face the Persian horde.

Re: Exploring
That's probably a good move. It worked well in Aeterna Civitas so I will add that to my list of things to do.

Re: Wonders
I was planning to include wonders. I need to be careful though as they tend to give a massive boost to the nations that are already the most powerful.

Re: Resources
Cities can only be founded on 'Colony Site' squares. I have used some of the terrains as Trade, Food and Shield resources. By doing this I can guarantee that the most advanced and wealthy cities historically are good sites to send colonists to. Should create some tension between the competing states for the best sites!

Thanks for the feedback, just what I was looking for!

[Alcibaides]

Re: Resources
Cities can only be founded on 'Colony Site' squares. I have used some of the terrains as Trade, Food and Shield resources. By doing this I can guarantee that the most advanced and wealthy cities historically are good sites to send colonists to. Should create some tension between the competing states for the best sites!

Is this a house rule? It seems I was able to build cities on any square....

I noted that the 'Citizen' unit seemed to be an extra powerful colonist (i.e. more movement and an attack strength). So why does it cost less shields to build than the regular colonist?

[McMonkey]

Have you read the game concepts part of the Civiliopedia? I think both questions should be answered there. I still need to do a little tweaking to the stats and unit costs.

Here's what the Civiliopedia says:

"@@SLAVES, ENGINEERS, COLONISTS and CITIZENS

Colonists are the only unit that is allowed to found cities. They can work the land and join cities too.

Citizens are the only unit allowed to join a city to boost its size. Useful if you want to get it to size 6 quickly.

Slaves can work the land only. They cannot found cities or join cities.

Engineers are more efficient than Slaves but have to follow the same rules."

Only size 6 cities can build Colonists. This is to prevent size one cities quickly building their own colonists and creating a chain of cities. They are expensive as founding a new colony is a major undertaking. Once founded Citizens from the parent city can be dispatched to boost the new colonies size. Slaves captured via warfare (Event when Rich Villages killed) or trained Engineers work the land. Colonies can only be founded on Colony sites. These are all house rules but they are quite straight forward. No complicated 'Rise of the Dictators' diplomatic house rules here

[Alcibaides]

I have noticed there are goody boxes all over the map, are these meant to be there? Sometimes you get an advanced tribe (not on a colony terrain square) or a wandering nomad (a colonist). Is this supposed to happen?

Have you considered that the Lydians will just build their cities where ever they want and have no restrictions on the number of colonists they build? This will mean that the Lydians will begin to get very large. Unless there is some way to stop them from building any settler type units. Maybe you could give them a special tech that makes these units obsolete?

I moved the Persian events to the turn they are supposed to occur (towards the end of the scenario) and I still have trouble fighting off the Lydians as the Ionians, every turn about 6 Lydian hoplites attack Miletus. Is that meant to happen?

[McMonkey]

The goody huts are meant to be there. The vest majority of the time you will get money (normally 25 or 50 gold) or troops. I used William Keenan's 'Barbarian paper' to ensure that the correct units appeared. If you do find a city there is a house rule saying it must be disbanded asap. You can then use the Colonist to found a city somewhere. If you find a wandering Colonist that's just a bonus, however this is a rare occurrence.

I stopped the Lydians from building settlers but they still seem to found new cities (cheating AI!). This may be due to them uncovering goody huts and finding Colonists or Cities. You cannot destroy the core Lydian cities due to the Eastern Fortress units, but any small settlements can, and should, be destroyed!

I will increase the cost of the Lydian Hoplites to see if that slows their attacks down. Playing as the Ionians will be tricky once the Persian events begin, but I didn't intend them to be attacked mercilessly from the beginning!

I completed a very smart looking html read me file (adapted from Kobayashi's Dianichi scenario one) which should make everything a little easier to comprehend. I probably still have a few bits to add to it but here it is: